Comments on: More on Rap: The Matter of Maturity

By: Anonymous

Anonymous — Sat, 17 Sep 2011 05:22:00 +0000

yes B is pregnant so it is official, Jay is mature.

By: Azmentl

Azmentl — Sat, 17 Sep 2011 01:20:00 +0000

I find the “maturity” critique difficult to address because it’s so absurd I don’t feel the inspiration to even tackle it. Mature in this sense seems to mean simply less emotional, as if the circumstances that give rise to the emotions and “immaturity” have receded. It’s that arrogant, “time to get over it,” that simply refuses to accept the unfortunate truth that the elements giving rise to the agony in this music, which rap is, persists. (note – admitting that white rock stars have been equally misogynistic does not excuse the misogyny, it merely points out potential discriminatory motives in critiques that overlook it).

By: Azmentl

Azmentl — Fri, 16 Sep 2011 00:12:00 +0000

I’ll comment more fully, but, fr the record, Elvis Costellohas impeccable taste. He is married to jazz singer and pianist Diana Krall. Is Beyonce pregnant?

By: Anonymous

Anonymous — Mon, 12 Sep 2011 03:18:00 +0000

Alyson, I like the point you make about cheating being all over the political world and entertainment world — so why oh why would anyone thinking seriously about music bring the issue to art? Art is the place where even the most mature married men get to dream about babes—- and women dream too. It is odd to me, even racist, to focus on this aspect of the artists’ lives— take even Elvis Costello, I mean I dunno who is he married to now and if/how he left his last wife.
I respect these guys, too— and one thing I really respect is that many of them have managed not to repeat the shitty childhoods they had— case in point, Jay Z sings a song about promising never to leave his son or daughter, because he was left by his father and he will “never repeat him.” Breaking the patterns of the past is one of the hardest things human beings do.

By: Arentrop

Arentrop — Mon, 12 Sep 2011 01:18:00 +0000

Maturity by definition is about reaching a state of full development or coming into one’s own. Jay Z and Kanye West rap about their defining experiences and provide an important commentary on issues of race, politics, and social injustice. What is more “mature” or enlightened than being able to put into words one’s point of view? It is nonsensical to negate the value of their artistic expression because critics take issue with the artists’ views on mongamy (and who knows if those views are really those of the artists’). Furthermore, look around…infidelity is common place in politics, in Hollywood, and in communities.

I have the utmost respect for artists like Jay Z, Kanye West, Tupac, The Roots (I could go on) who assert their opinions and their commentary on our far from perfect world. Sure, some of their lyrics are tongue and cheek (and critics need to realize the irony in much of Jay Z’s and Kanye’s lyrics). But they have the gravitas to speak their minds and for that, they should be commended.

By: Ann

Ann — Wed, 07 Sep 2011 07:57:00 +0000

Many good discussions could arise from your piece -Regarding ‘Watch the Throne’, I love the flow of the song ‘That’s my B…’ it is thought out and moves well, super catchy with messed up lyrics (is it for shock factor?) as it says on i-tunes ‘explicit’. Art makes you think. I believe music is art. The boys have definitely created their own art in this album with various topics and there seems a lot of dialogue, getting their voices heard and they have the fans to listen.

By: Rcozzi

Rcozzi — Wed, 07 Sep 2011 02:10:00 +0000

I have always believed that music is an art form and one that should be interpreted by the listener. Music critics get it wrong often because they are not true music fans or they simply do not take the time to really read between the lines. Any artist who is not afraid to take a stand earns points in my book. I really don’t think “maturity” matters.

By: Anonymous

Anonymous — Tue, 06 Sep 2011 23:24:00 +0000

interesting commentary. I like the separation that you make/assume between the art as an art form (so has their music grown, evolved, become more complicated) and the lyrics (politically aware, angry)—- I think the question of maturity is absurd too— but I do not agree that art is only subjective (whether we like something or not might be subjective) but for art to reach past itself (or past the artist), it must be partially objective as well.

By: Lunkhead

Lunkhead — Tue, 06 Sep 2011 23:21:00 +0000

I think the question of maturity in rap music is absurd. Have JayZ, Kanye West and others moved the genre forward.. sure. Does the pursuit of their art and their social commentary represent maturity? Who knows? Art is subjective. Do rap artists show maturity in commenting on racial strife and other social ills that plague our society? Or do rap artists show maturity through their musicality and advancement of their craft? To say that a rap artist is mature just because they make a poignant commentary does not necessarily mean they have matured as artists, just that they have been paying attention to the world around them